Help with German grading standards (2025)

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sturmgrenadier Posts: 158

August 7, 2008 11:45AM in

I recently bought the standard reference work 'Die Deutschen Munzen seit 1871' by Jaeger. My reading comprehension with respect to colloquial and business German is pretty good. But, wow, I really needed my dictionary's help for a technical field such as numismatic grading
In carefully re-reading the grading standards in the book, am I correct in concluding that Stufe 1 (polierte Platte) means a true proof (just like our US coins in which polished planchets and polished dies are used)? Also, SpiegelGlanze (also Stufe I) seems to most closely describe a Proof like coin with mirrored fields (only polished dies used). Stempelglanz (Stufe II) seems to be the equivalent of our mint-state circulation (business) strike? I have much more difficulty with understanding the circulated grades....

Vorzuglich (stufe III) states that the relief must be in perfect shape, but that there could be small bag marks/nicks in the fields. It also said that due to short circulation, some loss of lustre is acceptable for this grade. The closest equivalent I can find in our American grading system is a very high AU. Sehr scoh (stufe IV) sounds to me like it is a lower AU or high XF, because it is described as having small dings(verletzungen) on the relief and fields and minor wear marks on the relief (though essentially maintaining its design).

Could any German reading collectors/dealers tell me if I am on the mark with my interpretations of the grading standards? Please tell me if I am off the mark. In perusing the Geman dealers at places like MA-shops.com, i notice that many dealers sue simple abbreviations and borderline grades (fast vorzuglich) to describe their coins. THanks!

Silvereagle82 Posts: 1,219 ✭✭✭

August 7, 2008 11:58AM

Richard,
There are far more experts on this subject within the forum than I but this is a website that gives the basics
German Coin Grading
You may also want to do a "search" of the World & Ancient Forum for german grading tips. There have been several posted over the last few years.
JimK Posts: 605

August 7, 2008 1:16PM

Sturm,
Stempelglanz is Uncirculated
Vorzuglich is Extra Fine.
Sehr Schon is Very fine.
Polierte Platte is Proof.
Therefore Vorzuglich-Stempelglanz is AU
Here are a few other things to be aware of in descriptions:
Hklsp., Hksp. Henkelspur- trace of mounting, mounting removed, solder
kl. Kleine- Small, minor
winz. Winzige- very small, very little
Randf. Randfehler- rim nick
Prachtexemplar- splendid specimen, beauties, doozy
(sehr) selten (very) rare
just. justiert- adjust
bkfr., bfr. unzirkuliert / bankfrisch uncirculated = unc
Erh. Erhaltung conditions; grading
Jg. Jahrgang- year
kfr. kassenfrisch- crisp uncirculated
o.D. ohne Datum- undated
o.J. ohne Jahr- without year
Rs. Rückseite, Revers back, revers
Vs. Vorderseite obvers, frontside
clnd. gereinigt- cleaned
Patina - natürliche natural toned, toning
Patina - (fleckig) scattered toning spots
gelocht- holed
vergoldet- gilded
verschmutzt - dirty, soiled
zentriert- centered
Kratzer- scratched, detracting marks
Brustbild - bust
Auflage (höhe)- edition / mintage
Abb. Abbildung- picture
dezentriert- off-center
Prägeschwäche / schwache Prägung- weak strike
Riß- tear
ber. Berieben, Abreibung- rubbing
poliert, aufpoliert polished
fast stempelglanz near Uncirculated, so not 100% Uncirculated, but better than Extremely fine
fast vorzüglich near Extremly fine, so not 100% Extremely fine, but better than Very fine
ss+ besser als sehr schön- a little better than
See Also
Does anyone know a simple way to remove gilt from a silver coin?Fairmont Collection of Liberty Double Eagles - Page 3 The U1chicago Chicago token collection
You may have seen some of these.
One more thing I have noticed in German coin grading, they will sometimes say: 1, 2, 3, 4
1 is Stempelglanz (uncirculated)
2 is Vorzuglich (extra fine)
3 is Sehr Schone (very fine) etc...
If you see 1/2 I assume this means between 1 and 2 or their way of saying AU.
Hope this helps,
Jim
Silvereagle82 Posts: 1,219 ✭✭✭

August 24, 2008 2:08AM

jimk,
What about interpreting this description?
Kl. Schrötlingsfehler
JimK Posts: 605

August 24, 2008 2:20AM

<< <i>jimk,
What about interpreting this description?
Kl. Schrötlingsfehler >>
Kl. = small Schrotling= Planchet fehler= error/flaw
Hope this helps,
Jim
Silvereagle82 Posts: 1,219 ✭✭✭

August 24, 2008 2:22AM

Thanks !!!
JimK Posts: 605

August 24, 2008 2:24AM

Willkommen!
btw- for those who may be interested, here is an online munzen dictionary which should cover pretty much everything else not previously mentioned:
German Coin dictionary
Jim
JimK Posts: 605

September 2, 2008 9:04AM

OK, Here's one for better German speakers than myself:
"Erstabschlag"
I am not sure what this word means and I can't find it even on translators.
Just received a coin with this in the description and I had assumed when I bought it and looking at the coin that it meant "well struck" or something to that effect.... seems now that I have the coin in hand it might mean "early strike' or something similar, the surfaces are nearly proof-like.
Any ideas?
Jim
Preussen Posts: 2,307 ✭✭✭

September 2, 2008 9:08AM

<< <i>OK, Here's one for better German speakers than myself:
"Erstabschlag"
I am not sure what this word means and I can't find it even on translators.
Just received a coin with this in the description and I had assumed when I bought it and looking at the coin that it meant "well struck" or something to that effect.... seems now that I have the coin in hand it might mean "early strike' or something similar, the surfaces are nearly proof-like.
Any ideas?
Jim >>
First Strike. -Preussen

"Illegitimis non carborundum" -General Joseph Stilwell. See my auctions
JimK Posts: 605

September 2, 2008 9:21AM

Hey, I was close~
Thanks Preussen!
Jim
Preussen Posts: 2,307 ✭✭✭

September 2, 2008 9:34AM

<< <i>Hey, I was close~
Thanks Preussen!
Jim >>
Yes, you had the right idea . German Erstabschlags (EA) were truly the first ones struck, unlike the silly (IMO) designation given to U.S. modern crap™. Erstabschlags are normally the best of the mintage...well struck and often Proof-Llike...sometimes P/L to the point of fooling even the top tier grading services. More than one EA has been slabbed as a Proof, and sometimes it's virtually impossible to tell an EA from a Proof. -Preussen

"Illegitimis non carborundum" -General Joseph Stilwell. See my auctions
JimK Posts: 605

September 2, 2008 10:02AM

>>
Yes, you had the right idea . German Erstabschlags (EA) were truly the first ones struck, unlike the silly (IMO) designation given to U.S. modern crap™. Erstabschlags are normally the best of the mintage...well struck and often Proof-Llike...sometimes P/L to the point of fooling even the top tier grading services. More than one EA has been slabbed as a Proof, and sometimes it's virtually impossible to tell an EA from a Proof. -Preussen >>
Thanks for that~ I can easily see how this one might be mistaken for a proof. If not for the sweet edge toning this coin also looks like it might have been struck yesterday- not bad considering it's approx. 116 years old! (1982A 1 Mark)
Perhaps a pic is in order when I get the chance~
Jim
JimK Posts: 605

September 2, 2008 11:03AM

Here she is....
Quick pics and a copy and paste into the template. These pics do not show the proper toning colors, but they do show how 'frosty' looking the devices are:
I'll try to get some better pics next time.
Jim
Preussen Posts: 2,307 ✭✭✭

September 2, 2008 10:51PM

<< <i>Here she is....Jim >>
Looks good -Preussen

"Illegitimis non carborundum" -General Joseph Stilwell. See my auctions